Well it's not a bad idea perse, if your happy to see the creation of a two tier health system. Personally I think the NHS is far too precious an institution to completely give up on but I take your point about it being too big to control.
I am sorry you have recently had bad health and that you didn't get the service you needed, this is one of the problems with discussing the NHS, dispite its ideological nod to universal treatment it does in fact differ dramatically from region to region, I think part of the reason for that is ill-thought attempts (largely in the nineties) to introduce market values and mechanisms which could never really work on such an extraordinary and unique organisation.
I have to say though that were it not for the NHS (warts and all) I would definately not be alive today, nor most probably my son. In terms of value for money most people are happy with the service, we'd see a large rise in deaths from curable cancers if patients were faced with the bill for treatment I think.

Originally Posted by CAGAN

It's my opinion that regardless of what funds are thrown at it the NHS will never work. It's just to damn big, and in actual fact is Britain's biggest employer.

For the first time in my life I have had to use it properly. I have just had surgery which should have been done at least six months. Due to both professional incompetence by my doctor and administrational incompetence by the hospital my life has been somewhat miserable.
My proposal is that we have an option to opt out and have our NI contributions halved. The private sector would be fighting for our business and thus the price of private insurance would fall. Needless to say this proposal would have to have many details ironed out.

What do you think of this idea and do you have any better ones ?

Sorry to hear about your experiences CAGAN, I hope you're well on the road to recovery now!

I for one would welcome such a change with open arms. I can see the necessity of having a catch-all basic healthcare system for those people who either don't work, are on low pay or who for any other reason can't afford or don't want to pay any additional private medical insurance. However on top of this I personally see no problems with having an extra layer of service which could offer a faster and more comfortable service, and with a wider-ranging number of medical options available, for those people who wish to use it.

As you say, the necessity to opt-out of certain areas of NHS work should go hand in hand with this, however whilst it would reduce the total amount of prepaid NHS revenues from NI contributions (but then again there'd be less people to treat), it could easily be structured so that individual NHS hospitals could carry out private work for a percentage of the private fee charged. This would go a considerable way to making up any shortfall. Much improved efficiency and effective use of services would more than make up any other difference.

I doubt that many people would deny that the NHS is a large and lumbering organisation which is slow to respond to any change, is far too bureaucratically driven, and often just doesn't meet even basic standards of service or quality - there are plenty of media reports revealing this! Personally I can't see any real objections to such a restructuring other than ideological ones. It would result in better, faster services, and wider range services where needed without affecting the basic free facilities, and as you also point out, bring the price of private top-up cover tumbling down. A win-win situation.

Originally Posted by CAGAN

It's my opinion that regardless of what funds are thrown at it the NHS will never work. It's just to damn big, and in actual fact is Britain's biggest employer.

For the first time in my life I have had to use it properly. I have just had surgery which should have been done at least six months. Due to both professional incompetence by my doctor and administrational incompetence by the hospital my life has been somewhat miserable.
My proposal is that we have an option to opt out and have our NI contributions halved. The private sector would be fighting for our business and thus the price of private insurance would fall. Needless to say this proposal would have to have many details ironed out.

What do you think of this idea and do you have any better ones ?

I'm sorry, what? America can charge whatever it likes for healthcare to those without insurance.

And don't even mention incompetence. As a budding doctor (just finished my GCSE's!) myself, those poor souls get so overworked for a pittance. Please do not confuse incompetence with the overworked and underslept conditions doctors call a profession.

The NHS is an asset. What we really need is more doctors. Without the NHS, job and legal security go out the window and doctors will be forced to compete and be hung out to dry when the crap hits the fan. If you had studied for 5-6 years, what the hell would you do if you weren't accepted?

As a footnote: might I remind CAGAN that the NHS made a surplus in 2008: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7730227.stm

Originally Posted by syphro

I'm sorry, what? America can charge whatever it likes for healthcare to those without insurance.

And don't even mention incompetence. As a budding doctor (just finished my GCSE's!) myself, those poor souls get so overworked for a pittance. Please do not confuse incompetence with the overworked and underslept conditions doctors call a profession.

The NHS is an asset. What we really need is more doctors. Without the NHS, job and legal security go out the window and doctors will be forced to compete and be hung out to dry when the crap hits the fan. If you had studied for 5-6 years, what the hell would you do if you weren't accepted?

As a footnote: might I remind CAGAN that the NHS made a surplus in 2008: BBC NEWS | Health | Surplus 'fantastic opportunity'

I accept that the NHS needs more doctors (preferably that speak English) and junior doctors work stupid hours. I disagree with the rest though. A GP earns in the region of £120,000 pa and does little more than prescribe antibiotics and pain killers, any more than that and he just sends you to a so called specialist. I have just had a bi lateral epididymectomy which was necessary due a chemically infected epididymis caused through heavy lifting. My doctor initially diagnosed me with penal warts and sent me to the clap clinic. If that isn't incompetence, I don't what is.

Originally Posted by CAGAN

I accept that the NHS needs more doctors (preferably that speak English) and junior doctors work stupid hours. I disagree with the rest though. A GP earns in the region of £120,000 pa and does little more than prescribe antibiotics and pain killers, any more than that and he just sends you to a so called specialist. I have just had a bi lateral epididymectomy which was necessary due a chemically infected epididymis caused through heavy lifting. My doctor initially diagnosed me with penal warts and sent me to the clap clinic. If that isn't incompetence, I don't what is.

They are paid nothing compared to the hours they work. They also went through an extra 13-14 years training to get the job. Compared to a stock broker they do a huge amount of work. It's not a simple as persciptions either they have to babysit sixth-formers

'Incompetence', stress and fear (of killing a patient) are the fabric of the medical profession. Your doctor was either having a bad day (very very common) or was distracted by outside things. You have to also understand these people are human and are not textbooks otherwise self-diagnosis would be more accurate. Doctors are very self-sacraficial, unless they manage their time brilliantly, hardly any of them have a social life.