On 29th June 2007, my daughter was attacked by Muslims. She was at Tiger Tiger nightclub in Haymarket, London.
Fortunately the main perpetrator of this crime, Kafeel Ahmed, is now dead after suffering fatal burns at Glasgow airport in another attack.

Uncon, weren't you attacked when the tube in London was attacked? ... if not directly...

Over the years I've travelled quite extensively to most of the Islamic countries surrounding the Gulf and to other Islamic states elsewhere in the world including places like the Yemen, Iran, Egypt and Indonesia, and I can honestly say that in all my visits I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of Muslims I've met who were in any way more aggressive in their views toward the West as a whole than the average person in the street here is toward them. I've also yet to meet a single Muslim who I could in any way describe as a fundamentalist or whose attitude toward violence is any different to that of the average Christian. Yes, there's certainly a widespread anti-American feeling (although to be fair this isn't just confined to Islamic countries) among the general populations, which isn't surprising given America's attitude to much of the world, but as individual people, if anything I've found they're more welcoming than many I've met in the West.

The problem is perception and the silence of the majority due the attitude of Islam toward non-Muslims and the speaking out against Islam.

The overwhelming majority of Muslims do not agree with the violence perpetrated in their name, the problem is they do not speak out against it due to the rules of Islam that prevent normal Muslims from speaking out against the religion in any way the Mullah's do not like, even then this speaking out is against those who defame the religion. Until the average Muslim in the street can freely speak out against those who subvert the religion, defile the innocent and abuse the easily mislead then the public perception of Islam will not change as the majority of people, regardless of culture, see it as silence = indirect support, even when this is not the case.

The other problem is that many Muslims do desire the world to be Muslim and they do have a hatred of the West (politically) that is hard to counter. Further they like to live in their own communities and generally help only Muslims. The Red Cross helps anyone in any nation where they are needed, they do not ask religion or politics, but there are many cases of the Red Crescent only helping Muslims, and sometimes even restricting this to either Sunni or She'it depending on the local politics. I have experienced this first hand and it is rather a disgusting practice.

You see if someone speaks out against an Arch-Bishop ten it is seen as an attack on him, but if you speak out against a Mullah, then it is perceived by the majority of Muslims as an attack on Islam, and this fundamental difference in attitude is a key cultural and political difference. Lets not also forget that in the vast majority of Muslim countries it is illegal to practice Christianity, build a place of non-Muslim worship or even wear anything that indicates your a Christian. In many countries of the Middle East is is also an offence to own a Bible as this is seen as a offence against Islam..you can actually be executed for it by being stoned to death (although I don't think this has happened for sometime).

If Islam wants to have peace with the West then it needs to change in some fundamental ways that bring it into the 21st Century and the only wy this will happen is for rank and file Muslims to force these changes, until that happens the East/West issues will continue.

What has interested me is the number of organisations formed by Muslims who seek to show that peaceful live and let live side. it interests me that Christians can take two views about for example Homosexuality; one side will condemnm and the other side will love all humanity regardless. There is room for manouvre in every religion and the majority of Islamic people want to do that, yet it is the bad apple spoils the barrel syndrome isn't it?


Personally I love Seeks..everyone is welcome who wants to worship. It's like joining a hug club with a few dress rules

Originally Posted by uncon

What has interested me is the number of organisations formed by Muslims who seek to show that peaceful live and let live side. it interests me that Christians can take two views about for example Homosexuality; one side will condemnm and the other side will love all humanity regardless. There is room for manouvre in every religion and the majority of Islamic people want to do that, yet it is the bad apple spoils the barrel syndrome isn't it?


Personally I love Seeks..everyone is welcome who wants to worship. It's like joining a hug club with a few dress rules

You are so right. One of my dearest friends is a 'born again' Christian and she looks for the good in every one. Her view is that the Christian doctrine quite clearly considers homosexuality a sin, but that a true Christian will hate the sin but love the sinner, and she lives very successfully by this belief.

The vast majority of religions are forces for good. It is mankind and his distortion of doctrine to create schisms which turn them into forces for evil.

As you so rightly say the majority of Muslims, along with the majority of followers of most religions and philosophies, simply want to lead a peaceful life, follow their beliefs. They share the same aspirations, hopes and disappointments as society at large.

I share your positive view of the Sikh religion. When I was in the north of India for a couple of weeks a year or two ago, I had a Sikh driver, and I have rarely met a human being so at peace with himself and with the world around him. A man with limited education but immense wisdom. He took me to a Sikh temple, where I learned that not only is the temple open to all who want to worship, but for any in need food and drink will be provided, none are turned away.