Can The BNP Reform and should they?

[sarasara]

I have been a supporter of first labour and then the Conservatives and my wish has always been for a united, tolerant Britain but with commonsense policies to preserve our national identity and assist everyone to integrate which I believe can only happen if we stop funding ghettoising multiculturalism and have sensible immigration policies which allow those immigrants here to settle down.

Over the years I have trodden the pavements to campaign for one governent after another who has promised these things and let me down. I finally realised that we now live in a one party state in which a liberal cabal have seamlessly merged into one group with three different colours; blue, red and yellow. They are all signed up to setting up areas of multicultural segregation in which groups are paid to live in Balkanised communities; marrying within them, and developing hostility, disrespect and disinterest for the host community.

And worst in Pakistani areas; generation after generation marrying first cousins from Pakistan in order to ensure that their lineage remains unpolluted by British values and norms, where wives cannot speak English and integration never happens.

Many young Asians are growing up never even having watched British television; taking their news from Pakistan or India. News inevatably biased and hostile to Britain. Young people who live outside popular culture; that point at which a new generation develops the reference points which mark out their future relations with others in the country.

I have experienced this at first hand. I have been told proudly by a young Pakistani girl from Bradford that Bradford is "An island off Pakistan." I have Asian friends who would consider watching BBC or ITV etc as though it were porn and live on a diet of Bollywood and preachers.

The adoption of Burqa and Jilbab is an expression of the disdain young women from the 'Stans' we now host in various cities have for us, and the need not to become polluted by our company.

Meanwhile one community has escaped the multicultural trap and that is the African-Carribean community. They always wanted to integrate and have brought us great heroes of sport, entertainment and other achievements to come. They should be the template by which government policy looks at Asians generally and Muslims in particular.

The BNP are opposed to Multiculturalism and immigration. Surely the two most important issues we face today. Because Multiculturalism is racism and a threat to communal harmony while immigration threatens our becoming an over-populated, third-world country with eternal mass unemployment, in a period of history where unskilled jobs are bleeding abroad.

I believe that the only party which can save Britains and in particular England's heritage, values and identity is the BNP, but they have to reform by opening up their membership and accepting anyone who signs up to a United Britain.

I am far more worried from a Jewish perspective about the Left including groups like UNITE who are almost to a man bent on furthering the destruction of the democratic State of Israel which they have decided is a fascist state, while supporting the fascist Hamas and Hezbollah. That is a united front of anti-Semitism which makes the BNP mild by comparison. Mr Griffin has now accepted the Holocaust happened, has a Jewish BNP councellor and is moving his party away from the previous stances of John Tyndall.

The British government is spending huge sums to try to buy loyalty and reform from hard-line Islamist groups like the MCB; the UK branch of the Muslim Brotherhood, who disgraced the Cenotaph by their invited presence this morning. Yet it has no wish to pressure the BNP to reform. I wonder why?

[DC]

I think it is starting to reform...slowly. After the next election it's likely the membership will continue to grow. Even if the economic crisis abates Britain's social crisis will be out in the open and still draw membership. The fascist claims of the UAF seem to be sensationalist. To suggest the BNP could ever institute a policy like segregation or even mass-forced repatriation is absurd. The BNP also impressed me by being the only Party to support Israel's attack on Gaza.

[LA]

Can the BNP reform?

Depends.

If you take the BNP's core principals as racism, discrimination, white supremacy and other not-so-pleasant ideological convictions, then no, they cannot reform. Extremist ideologies may get a new mask but the face is the same.

If, however, the BNP's core principals is the supremacy of Britain in the world, protectionism, splendid isolation, and the preservation of British culture, values, religion and identify, then yes of course they can reform.

[angelcountry]

What you should note is that, the people they're racist against aren't tired of the challenges facing them, we might put it this way, we're ready both physically, mentally, legally, with reasonable force neccessary to free ourself from the evil threat of our 21st century world.

Lastly, freedom is what you have to fight for yourself, and dont blame a ''cracker'' for all the ''injustices'' because theres nobody to check balance and if the people that are to check balance them are of the same people by the people and for the people here the dilemma continues, but who is to always blame for it ?

We dont want a nation to look like is not been govern by anybody at these age in time.

You and i need to sort that aspect out sunner rather than latter.

[Midas]

What you should note is that, the people they're racist against aren't tired of the challenges facing them, we might put it this way, we're ready both physically, mentally, legally, with reasonable force neccessary to free ourself from the evil threat of our 21st century world.

Is that an implication that ethnic minorities are preparing to violently defend themselves against what you see as 'the evil threat of our 21st century world'? What is it that you see specifically as representing this threat, because where I stand much of it can be directly attributed to some people from some ethnic minorities making totally unreasonable demands to have their own cultures and religions incorporated into the laws of their adopted home countries, thus angering the indigenous population. When in Rome and all that......

[DC]

'When in Rome...' should be the immigration policy.

[sarasara]

Good stuff so far, I personally think that this is the most important debate of any of the threads on this page to enter into.

[Neo2012]

I think it is starting to reform...slowly. After the next election it's likely the membership will continue to grow. Even if the economic crisis abates Britain's social crisis will be out in the open and still draw membership. The fascist claims of the UAF seem to be sensationalist. To suggest the BNP could ever institute a policy like segregation or even mass-forced repatriation is absurd. The BNP also impressed me by being the only Party to support Israel's attack on Gaza.

it has nothing to do with the the UAF. The constitutionaly stated raison d'être of the BNP is to be "opposed to all forms of racial integration" and "to restoring, by legal changes, negotiation and consent, the overwhelmingly white make up of the British population that existed in Britain prior to 1948."

That a party should have at its core of its ideology this belief, is enough for the vast majority of people, parties, social institutions etc to consider the BNP polecat party. The treatment of Griffin on question time, was wholly in line with how the vast majority of people feel about Griffin. This was reflected in the fact, that support for the BBC's choice of giving Griffin a platform for his fascist views, actually increased once they saw how he was treated.

Why does the BNP have this at the core of its ideology? Griffins background is of his entire adult life being involved with neo NAZI and racist organizations. Until this hard core of neo Nazis is expelled, the vast majority of people in this country will not be convinced the BNP has reformed.

[Neo2012]

The British government is spending huge sums to try to buy loyalty and reform from hard-line Islamist groups like the MCB; the UK branch of the Muslim Brotherhood, who disgraced the Cenotaph by their invited presence this morning. Yet it has no wish to pressure the BNP to reform. I wonder why?

2.5 million non-white from the British empire served in the First World War. 4000 Indians died in one battle.

[Neo2012]

Good stuff so far, I personally think that this is the most important debate of any of the threads on this page to enter into.

Pretty strange comment IMHO, seeing as there has been no factual discussion on the thread title, the fascist roots of the BNP, the stated aims of the BNP, and its ability to reform.
Can it be reformed? Will they have the guts to get rid of Griffin, Collett etc? I think the answer lies in the 2008 constitution of the BNP. This has some beautiful gems like;

Quote:

YouTube - The Constitution of the BNP
The leader can;
Change sections of the constitution without consultation with the members
Block any proposals from anyone asking for a change to the constitution
Dismiss any BNP member for anything he sees fit
Proscribe members from having any contact with any individual or organisation he chooses
The BNP is currently NOT a democratic party. So Y, would you trusted to be democratic in government.

Why bother when there is a perfectly feasible non-fascist alternative, UKIP?

PS. more info;
The BNP 9th edition constitution is available here http://www.bnp.org.uk/pdf_files/Const...

The 10th Edition Constitution is here:
http://bnp.org.uk/resources/constitut...

This is a call to all members of the BNP. Read your constitution.

This video does not imply anything about BNP members being racist, or fascist. I now see that many of them are nothing of the sort.

But BNP members have no control over the BNP party. Even though you pay some steep membership fees.

Are you happy with that?

The Labour Party constitution is available to Labour members on Labour Members Net on the Labour web site.

The Conservative constitution is here : http://www.conservatives.com/pdf/cfco...

The Liberal Democrat constitution is here:
http://www.libdems.org.uk/www.libdems...

[sarasara]

UKIP is not an alternative to anything. It is a single-issue party with no future. The BNP needs to enter into a private consultation process with certain leading figures such as Norman Tebbit about how it can reform, hold a private leaders conference followed by an open party conference and re-brand asap. Cease to become a party of hate and prejudice and self-indulgent victimhood, welcome people of all races who will sign up to the agenda of a united Britain, loyal to it's histoy and values, committed to ending all funding and promotion of multiculturalism and very tough on immigration and crime.

It should make it clear that it will no longer tolerate racism, anti-Semitism and homophobia and if that encourages many to walk out so much the better. The more party members who say "I joined the BNP because I hate black people and am leaving because it wont tolerate my views." the better, because the party will get more votes a result.

The three main parties are so deeply enmeshed in a liberal cabal that they are beyond reforming or understanding that they are distanced from the people. Only a reformed BNP can bring back some of the original values of the two main parties and save Britain from becoming a balkanised, multicultural nightmare province of Europe. To do that the BNP must also ditch its childish leftist, non-Churchillian attitudes to the United States.

Some government ministers used to be anarchists or worse but they have moved on and changed their views. Nick Griffin has moved but he needs to move much more.

[LA]

If UKIP is a single issue party than so is the BNP.
Whereas UKIP's main focus was on Europe, the BNP's main focus is on Immigration.

UKIP have developed a lot of policies for a wide range of issues, almost all of which I agree with - I am unsure of their tax proposals.

[CAGAN]

I have been a supporter of first labour and then the Conservatives and my wish has always been for a united, tolerant Britain but with commonsense policies to preserve our national identity and assist everyone to integrate which I believe can only happen if we stop funding ghettoising multiculturalism and have sensible immigration policies which allow those immigrants here to settle down.

Over the years I have trodden the pavements to campaign for one governent after another who has promised these things and let me down. I finally realised that we now live in a one party state in which a liberal cabal have seamlessly merged into one group with three different colours; blue, red and yellow. They are all signed up to setting up areas of multicultural segregation in which groups are paid to live in Balkanised communities; marrying within them, and developing hostility, disrespect and disinterest for the host community.

And worst in Pakistani areas; generation after generation marrying first cousins from Pakistan in order to ensure that their lineage remains unpolluted by British values and norms, where wives cannot speak English and integration never happens.

Many young Asians are growing up never even having watched British television; taking their news from Pakistan or India. News inevatably biased and hostile to Britain. Young people who live outside popular culture; that point at which a new generation develops the reference points which mark out their future relations with others in the country.

I have experienced this at first hand. I have been told proudly by a young Pakistani girl from Bradford that Bradford is "An island off Pakistan." I have Asian friends who would consider watching BBC or ITV etc as though it were porn and live on a diet of Bollywood and preachers.

The adoption of Burqa and Jilbab is an expression of the disdain young women from the 'Stans' we now host in various cities have for us, and the need not to become polluted by our company.

Meanwhile one community has escaped the multicultural trap and that is the African-Carribean community. They always wanted to integrate and have brought us great heroes of sport, entertainment and other achievements to come. They should be the template by which government policy looks at Asians generally and Muslims in particular.

The BNP are opposed to Multiculturalism and immigration. Surely the two most important issues we face today. Because Multiculturalism is racism and a threat to communal harmony while immigration threatens our becoming an over-populated, third-world country with eternal mass unemployment, in a period of history where unskilled jobs are bleeding abroad.

I believe that the only party which can save Britains and in particular England's heritage, values and identity is the BNP, but they have to reform by opening up their membership and accepting anyone who signs up to a United Britain.

I am far more worried from a Jewish perspective about the Left including groups like UNITE who are almost to a man bent on furthering the destruction of the democratic State of Israel which they have decided is a fascist state, while supporting the fascist Hamas and Hezbollah. That is a united front of anti-Semitism which makes the BNP mild by comparison. Mr Griffin has now accepted the Holocaust happened, has a Jewish BNP councellor and is moving his party away from the previous stances of John Tyndall.

The British government is spending huge sums to try to buy loyalty and reform from hard-line Islamist groups like the MCB; the UK branch of the Muslim Brotherhood, who disgraced the Cenotaph by their invited presence this morning. Yet it has no wish to pressure the BNP to reform. I wonder why?

Good thread. Unfortunately the main parties have brainwashed the majority of the public into thinking the BNP is evil and a multicultural society is a good thing for the country. Unfortunately multiculturalism has never, doesn't and never will work. People from similar cultures who immigrated into this country can integrate quite happily, whereas people who insist on bringing their own culture with them will always have problems. The more alien the culture the bigger the problem.

Personally I agree with controlled immigration, however it should be to suite the country and NOT the person who wants to live here. I am a strong believer in taxing immigrants very highly in order we could reduce taxes for the indigenous population. I also believe immigrants should not have access to the welfare state for at least five years.

I would like to see the BNP widen spectrum of policies before I could ever consider voting for them. I have as yet never found any of their policies on immigration particularly racist and am aware that they have voters from minority groups.

[DC]

And do I have to explain to everyone again why the BNP are not fascist? They're racist, but not fascist, please people make the distinction.

[Midas]

Good thread. Unfortunately the main parties have brainwashed the majority of the public into thinking the BNP is evil and a multicultural society is a good thing for the country. Unfortunately multiculturalism has never, doesn't and never will work. People from similar cultures who immigrated into this country can integrate quite happily, whereas people who insist on bringing their own culture with them will always have problems. The more alien the culture the bigger the problem.

Hmm, not entirely. Any culture is comprised of what's gone before it, which in most cases, and certainly as regards to the UK, is the gradual assimilation of a range of ideas, beliefs and practices brought by immigrants, regardless of whether they're similar or not - the word gradual being the key. Where you are right though is that the sudden mass influx of immigrants with very different beliefs, a significant number of whom won't integrate and are outspoken about their assumed right not only not to integrate but to impose their own beliefs, is bound to cause problems.

Personally I agree with controlled immigration, however it should be to suite the country and NOT the person who wants to live here. I am a strong believer in taxing immigrants very highly in order we could reduce taxes for the indigenous population. I also believe immigrants should not have access to the welfare state for at least five years.

Yes to controlled immigration, significantly so, and to the denial of welfare services, however I think that a period of two years is probably sufficient for those who are accepted into the country by way of either their financial status or specific knowledge and expertise. A minor detail in the wider scheme of things though.

I would like to see the BNP widen spectrum of policies before I could ever consider voting for them. I have as yet never found any of their policies on immigration particularly racist and am aware that they have voters from minority groups.

As I've said elsewhere I don't think that this will ever happen. The BNP have their roots, leadership and name too firmly entrenched in the racist past for them to move on. What this country really needs is for all the minor parties to get together, forget their petty squabbles, and come up with some coherent plan which will be credible to the public and effective at mounting a major challenge to the existing political triumvirate. But I'm afraid from the way things look right now, before this happens.

[Neo2012]

UKIP is not an alternative to anything. It is a single-issue party with no future. The BNP needs to enter into a private consultation process with certain leading figures such as Norman Tebbit about how it can reform, hold a private leaders conference followed by an open party conference and re-brand asap. Cease to become a party of hate and prejudice and self-indulgent victimhood, welcome people of all races who will sign up to the agenda of a united Britain, loyal to it's histoy and values, committed to ending all funding and promotion of multiculturalism and very tough on immigration and crime.

It should make it clear that it will no longer tolerate racism, anti-Semitism and homophobia and if that encourages many to walk out so much the better. The more party members who say "I joined the BNP because I hate black people and am leaving because it wont tolerate my views." the better, because the party will get more votes a result.

The three main parties are so deeply enmeshed in a liberal cabal that they are beyond reforming or understanding that they are distanced from the people. Only a reformed BNP can bring back some of the original values of the two main parties and save Britain from becoming a balkanised, multicultural nightmare province of Europe. To do that the BNP must also ditch its childish leftist, non-Churchillian attitudes to the United States.

Some government ministers used to be anarchists or worse but they have moved on and changed their views. Nick Griffin has moved but he needs to move much more.

Tebbit wouldn't spit on BNP.

And Griffin has clearly stated he hasn't sold out the BNP'S [fascist] ideas.

[Neo2012]

And do I have to explain to everyone again why the BNP are not fascist? They're racist, but not fascist, please people make the distinction.

yup, cos griffin don't agree he's sold out.

[Neo2012]

Good thread. Unfortunately the main parties have brainwashed the majority of the public into thinking the BNP is evil

Why, why, why, do bnp apologist's, regularly suggest there is a conspiracy, by 'the elite', to brainwash people? Why can't you just accept;
1. the main parties, and the majority of people believe Griffin and the hard core of the BNP are sick twisted extremists racists.
2. And the overwhelming majority of evidence supports this hypothesis.

[DC]

yup, cos griffin don't agree he's sold out.

A big fat ZERO of the BNP's policies are fascist.

[DavidRose]

Why, why, why, do bnp apologist's, regularly suggest there is a conspiracy, by 'the elite', to brainwash people? Why can't you just accept;
1. the main parties, and the majority of people believe Griffin and the hard core of the BNP are sick twisted extremists racists.
2. And the overwhelming majority of evidence supports this hypothesis.

Why does the left believe in a capitalist cabal which controls the world and yet when the right does the same they are just trying to delude themselves?

As support for the BNP grows racism will come to be seen as a positive thing which is actually a return to the word's original meaning.

[Kiwi 1691]

'When in Rome...' should be the immigration policy.

WTH, do you seriously believe that?

Multiculturalism is the way forward. It is great to see the different mixes of cultures in modern cities. Auckland for example has the largest Polynesian population of any city in the world, it also has one of the highest Chinese populations outside of China I heard recently. It is amazing to see all the different cultures mixing so well.

So stop living in the 19th century.

[DC]

WTH, do you seriously believe that?

Multiculturalism is the way forward. It is great to see the different mixes of cultures in modern cities. Auckland for example has the largest Polynesian population of any city in the world, it also has one of the highest Chinese populations outside of China I heard recently. It is amazing to see all the different cultures mixing so well.

So stop living in the 19th century.

Umm, multiculturalism is a recognised failure in about 90% of the places it's implemented. The Chinese are good example of how it can work out well. They work hard, generally obey the law and try to integrate. There's always a Chinatown in most major cities, but it isn't usually crime ridden and or overly cultural oppressive. Africans, Arabs as well as some Asian groups don't integrate so well, and form enclaves, which seem to always become crime-ridden ghettos.

The fundamental ideas of multiculturalism are flawed, it assumes that a group of one people can come, cluster together in one place and form miniture versions of their own countries which they don't have to leave. The result is they don't learn the local language, are succeptible to extremism and don't embrace the country they're actually living in, which defeats the purpose of immigration.

[sarasara]

A big fat ZERO of the BNP's policies are fascist.

The problem with the BNP is that it is a confused party, sometimes on the far right often on the far left, that's why I have such hope for it becoming one of the main parties and eventually forming a government. It contains seeds of the old conservatism and socialism that the main parties lost when they merged into a liberal cabal.

The real problem for the BNP is do they really care about Britain or do they just want to be moaning whingers and victims; losers not winners?

Are they willing to have blood on the carpet by marginalising racists, anti-Semites and homophobes? Are they willing to cease being a party of hate and accept all who will sign up to the really important agenda of creating a United Britain for all those legally here, end funding of multiculturalism at all levels, impose a very strict immigration policy.

A policy allowing refugees only to remain in the UK until the problems in their countries are sorted out, Stopping all relatives of immigrants being allowed to enter and remain in the country. Making first-cousin marriages from Pakistan more difficult and stripping immigrants and asylum seekers who break the law, of citizenship or right to remain, and deporting them back regardless?

Only if the BNP can appeal to an electorate of all races can it hope to win and save Britian from the horrible end it faces now. The clock is ticking for the end of Britain as we know it and the three main parties are determind to drown the British people in their multicultural, globalist, Euro agenda.

[Neo2012]

A big fat ZERO of the BNP's policies are fascist.

Show any fascist policies, from any fascist party, anytime, BEFORE they achieved power. ie, where is Hitler's policy on gas chambers.

Define what would qualifty also Please.

And give your definition of fascism, please, beacuse so far, it doen't seem to be the regular definition.

[LA]

And define fascism, please.

Click Here

[The Untalented Mr Ripley]

Show any fascist policies, from any fascist party, anytime, BEFORE they achieved power. ie, where is Hitler's policy on gas chambers.

Define what would qualifty also Please.

And give your definition of fascism, please, beacuse so far, it doen't seem to be the regular definition.

By your answer, am I to take it that you have nothing to substantiate the claim that the BNP are a fascist party, just conjecture and speculation?

That said, I don't remember having read in the Labour party's manifesto anything about embarking on illegal wars, so you never know.

[Neo2012]

Umm, multiculturalism is a recognised failure in about 90% of the places it's implemented. The Chinese are good example of how it can work out well. They work hard, generally obey the law and try to integrate. There's always a Chinatown in most major cities, but it isn't usually crime ridden and or overly cultural oppressive. Africans, Arabs as well as some Asian groups don't integrate so well, and form enclaves, which seem to always become crime-ridden ghettos.

Triads?
multiculturalism is a recognised failure in about 90% of the places it's implemented, by whom? You?
And do you think the british should be expelled from spain? There is no worse example, I am told by Brits in spain, of a group that don't integrate so well, and form enclaves, which seem to always become crime-ridden ghettos.

The fundamental ideas of multiculturalism are flawed, it assumes that a group of one people can come, cluster together in one place and form miniture versions of their own countries which they don't have to leave. The result is they don't learn the local language, are succeptible to extremism and don't embrace the country they're actually living in, which defeats the purpose of immigration.

Which advocate of multiculturalism assumes that a group of one people can come, cluster together in one place and form miniture versions of their own countries which they don't have to leave? I don't.

[Neo2012]

By your answer, am I to take it that you have nothing to substantiate the claim that the BNP are a fascist party, just conjecture and speculation?

That said, I don't remember having read in the Labour party's manifesto anything about embarking on illegal wars, so you never know.

It's history, and stated intentions/values, substantiate the claim that the BNP are a fascist party. Why do you think the insignifcant BNP was treated as a polecat party, all parties, media, social orgs, churches etc?

[The Untalented Mr Ripley]

It's history, and stated intentions/values, substantiate the claim that the BNP are a fascist party. Why do you think the insignifcant BNP was treated as a polecat party, all parties, media, social orgs, churches etc?

I think that there is great deal of hysteria concerning the BNP and I for one do not find the majority of their policies or underlying rationale as being remotely fascist, i.e. totalitarian and demaning subservience to the state. I do wish that they would get rid of their obsession with race and a raft of some of their nuttier ideas (bringing back the birch....really), but I applaud their desire to promote traditional social and cultural values.

Currently the real threat to our civil liberties come from the left in the from of the dying Labour party. I find it modertly amusing that so many get their nickers in a twist about what is at best a fringe party, whilst the 2 mainstream parties are left off the hook for supporting an illegal and disasterous war in Iraq.

[LA]

Triads?
multiculturalism is a recognised failure in about 90% of the places it's implemented, by whom? You?
And do you think the british should be expelled from spain? There is no worse example, I am told by Brits in spain, of a group that don't integrate so well, and form enclaves, which seem to always become crime-ridden ghettos.
Which advocate of multiculturalism assumes that a group of one people can come, cluster together in one place and form miniture versions of their own countries which they don't have to leave? I don't.

There is a slight difference.
The Brits in spain move there because
1/ They are rich
2/ They are retired

They are not criminals or poor and do not create crime ridden ghettos.

[Midas]

There is a slight difference.
The Brits in spain move there because
1/ They are rich
2/ They are retired

They are not criminals or poor and do not create crime ridden ghettos.

However they do, by and large, congregate in areas where there are many other Brits, carrying with them the British culture and forming middle class ghettos - if there is such a thing. Have you ever been along the Costa del Sol and seen them everywhere?

[Neo2012]

There is a slight difference.
The Brits in spain move there because
1/ They are rich
2/ They are retired

They are not criminals or poor and do not create crime ridden ghettos.

not according to the Brits I spoke to. working on black market, boosting crime, and drain health service. But I'm sure there are sme as you describe.
However, none of that was my point. I'm sure the children of these brits, will integrate, just like the blacks have done here, and the muslims will do. Why, because democracy, multi-culturalism, and freedom are benificial so seductive.

[Neo2012]

I think that there is great deal of hysteria concerning the BNP and I for one do not find the majority of their policies or underlying rationale as being remotely fascist, i.e. totalitarian and demaning subservience to the state. I do wish that they would get rid of their obsession with race and a raft of some of their nuttier ideas (bringing back the birch....really), but I applaud their desire to promote traditional social and cultural values.

it is Griffins stated position, not to nail their colours to the mast in public, but also not to sell out the ideas of upon which the BNP was founded, fascism.

Currently the real threat to our civil liberties come from the left in the from of the dying Labour party. I find it modertly amusing that so many get their nickers in a twist about what is at best a fringe party, whilst the 2 mainstream parties are left off the hook for supporting an illegal and disasterous war in Iraq.

you can oppose both, you don't have to jump from the frying pan into the fire.

[DavidRose]

WTH, do you seriously believe that?

Multiculturalism is the way forward. It is great to see the different mixes of cultures in modern cities. Auckland for example has the largest Polynesian population of any city in the world, it also has one of the highest Chinese populations outside of China I heard recently. It is amazing to see all the different cultures mixing so well.

So stop living in the 19th century.

It's interesting how the concept of multiculturalism has now legitimized the colonial possessions of the white world, even to the extent that non whites will now defend their right to be there.

[bullet]

multiculturalism is fine but we still all need our individuality and out own identity. We don't want to all become a bunch of Mc Donald's eating robots world wide. If you mix all colours together you end up with grey. We need to embrace multiculturalism while maintaining our individuality.

[British]

multiculturalism is fine but we still all need our individuality and out own identity. We don't want to all become a bunch of Mc Donald's eating robots world wide. If you mix all colours together you end up with grey. We need to embrace multiculturalism while maintaining our individuality.

I see what you are saying, Bullet. But from how I understand it, the Islamic requirements are not tolerant to any other cultural practice, but their own. At the rate at which they breed, and the rate they are shipped over, we WILL be the minority to them in our own country, probably within a decade. And whilst we in the BNP do not hate Muslims, we do understand that they are a direct threat to our own culture.
You never hear of Buddhist or Christian extremeists. Or any other cultural extremism. Nearly every day you can put the wireless on and hear of this, that and the other attack from Islamic extremists.
I agree, multiculturalism is fine, to an extent. Remembering that "when in Rome, do as the Romans do". But Islam is distroying this country.
When will the public wake up?

[Kiwi 1691]

I see what you are saying, Bullet. But from how I understand it, the Islamic requirements are not tolerant to any other cultural practice, but their own.

Really, what do you base that on?

I have yet to meet an intolerant Muslim in my life.

At the rate at which they breed, and the rate they are shipped over, we WILL be the minority to them in our own country, probably within a decade.

I didn't realise Muslims breed any faster than other groups?

And whilst we in the BNP do not hate Muslims,

Yes you do.

we do understand that they are a direct threat to our own culture.

Now that offended be greatly.

Britain spent the last few hundred years occupying nations and oppressing the natives.

Do you think the British asked the Maori in NZ before they flooded in? I highly doubt it.

Britain has destroyed cultures all over the world, and YOU DARE CLAIM that the British culture is being destroyed, just because some Muslims are moving to the UK.

I actually can't understand why they would even was to go to the uk as it seems that many Brits are racist BNP supporters.

You never hear of Buddhist or Christian extremeists.

Yes.

Some of the worst atrocities in human history were committed by Christians in the name of "GOD".

There are Buddhist extremists by they hurt themselves rather than others.

Nearly every day you can put the wireless on and hear of this, that and the other attack from Islamic extremists.

The modern day extremism is the expression of anger that has been growing for along time. This anger is the fault of the west.

I agree, multiculturalism is fine, to an extent.

NO, multiculturalism is how modern society lives, if you don't like it rip the laws of physics to shreds and go back to Victorian Britain.

Remembering that "when in Rome, do as the Romans do".

Why?

But Islam is destroying this country.

How?

When will the public wake up?

More like when will the public wake up and imprison all BNP members.

[DC]

Triads?

Oh so you agree that immigrant enclaves spread crime? Good we're on the same page then.

multiculturalism is a recognised failure in about 90% of the places it's implemented, by whom? You?
And do you think the british should be expelled from spain? There is no worse example, I am told by Brits in spain, of a group that don't integrate so well, and form enclaves, which seem to always become crime-ridden ghettos.

Point out the bit we're I said immigrants should be expelled.

Also I make no apologies for immigrant enclaves that refuse to integrate of any sort.

Which advocate of multiculturalism assumes that a group of one people can come, cluster together in one place and form miniture versions of their own countries which they don't have to leave? I don't.

Multi - meaning many or several
Culturalism - cultures

Many-Cultures

Not, one culture, or integrated cultures. Many, separate cultures.

[DC]

Really, what do you base that on?

I have yet to meet an intolerant Muslim in my life.

A: When the religion was originally founded it gained power by throwing out, violently, many other religions and tribes in the region.

B: Certain parts of the Koran advocate the spreading of Islam by any means, including overrunning other religions and cultures.

C: Women who travel to many Islamic countries must wear veils and are not allowed to drive or in certain areas. Westerners are not allowed in some Holy sites. While I don't disagree with this, it proves they aren't tolerant little liberal fairies.

D: According to Islam, all children are born Muslim, and are subsequently corrupted by other teachings.

I didn't realise Muslims breed any faster than other groups?

There are MANY statistics for this.

The modern day extremism is the expression of anger that has been growing for along time. This anger is the fault of the west.

No it isn't.

NO, multiculturalism is how modern society lives, if you don't like it rip the laws of physics to shreds and go back to Victorian Britain.

Multiculturalism has failed. That's why there are ghettos forming in the UK. Bradford, many parts of Birmingham, they are all becoming enclaves where nobody speaks English and crime is rampant and they become breeding grounds for extremists.

Why?

Because you in another country where different behavior is required and expected. It is polite and you can avoid many difficulties and don't insult people.

We can't all walk around acting as if our culture is the best and rubbing it in people's faces. Because that's what Americans do and what the colonialists did.

[Midas]

A: When the religion was originally founded it gained power by throwing out, violently, many other religions and tribes in the region.

So did early Chrisianity, certainly as told in the Old Testament.

B: Certain parts of the Koran advocate the spreading of Islam by any means, including overrunning other religions and cultures.

So does the Bible, certainly the Old Testament.

C: Women who travel to many Islamic countries must wear veils and are not allowed to drive or in certain areas. Westerners are not allowed in some Holy sites. While I don't disagree with this, it proves they aren't tolerant little liberal fairies.

True in part, however there's a little bit of a myth about the laws surrounding women and clothing in parts of the Muslim world. Even in Saudi Arabia you'll find many women, especially the current generation, wearing totally western clothing both at home and at work, and if you peep underneath their burqas outdoors (probably not to be advised ) where customs are still much stronger I'd agree, you'll find almost as many mini skirts and jeans as here. It might come as a surprise, but several western women's fashion shops like Next and Zara have branches in the Jeddah shopping malls such as Hera, selling exactly the same clothes as they do in the UK.

D: According to Islam, all children are born Muslim, and are subsequently corrupted by other teachings.

I can't say I've ever heard anyone, Muslim or not, make comment on this.

But interesting as it may be, this is all rather as far as the BNP reforming is concerned.

[DC]

So did early Chrisianity, certainly as told in the Old Testament.
So does the Bible, certainly as told in the Old Testament.

Never said they didn't.

[British]

There are Christians in the old testoment. There never was.
Kiwi, you, and your lot, I have no time for you. This will be the only time I address you. As for all I have said, I stick with it. You keep on with historical accounts. I never did refare to the past. I'm talking about the present. And you reallyl must clue up on your facts before making a fool of yourself

[LA]

I didn't realise Muslims breed any faster than other groups?

They have a very very high birth rate.

I actually can't understand why they would even was to go to the uk as it seems that many Brits are racist BNP supporters.

Most people who vote for the BNP do so out of the failure of the Labour Government/mainstream parties rather than racism.

Some of the worst atrocities in human history were committed by Christians in the name of "GOD".

Same as with Islam.

The modern day extremism is the expression of anger that has been growing for along time. This anger is the fault of the west.

You hate the west that much stop using western technology.
Get off the Internet. You clearly don't appreciate it.

NO, multiculturalism is how modern society lives, if you don't like it rip the laws of physics to shreds and go back to Victorian Britain.

Can you prove the bold?

More like when will the public wake up and imprison all BNP members.

So you do disagree with the Freedoms of speech, expression and association?
Wow such a totalitarian. You were annoyed when the British oppressed people yet you would advocate the very same.

Hypocratical!

[uncon]

There are Christians in the old testoment. There never was.
Kiwi, you, and your lot, I have no time for you. This will be the only time I address you. As for all I have said, I stick with it. You keep on with historical accounts. I never did refare to the past. I'm talking about the present. And you reallyl must clue up on your facts before making a fool of yourself

****ing hell!

It's like being heckled in the pub! Bring on the Karaoke

[Barry]

Deleted

[Major Sinic]

There are Christians in the old testoment. There never was.
Kiwi, you, and your lot, I have no time for you. This will be the only time I address you. As for all I have said, I stick with it. You keep on with historical accounts. I never did refare to the past. I'm talking about the present. And you reallyl must clue up on your facts before making a fool of yourself

At the risk of stating the obvious there was no Christianity before Christ.

The Old Testament (a collection of myths, legends, parables and papyrus and parchment scrolls) was subsequently incorporated into the Christian doctrine after the death of Christ, primarily as evidence (as far as a Christian is concerned anyway) that the story of Christ's life had been foretold, and was therefore not an accident of circumstance but part of God's plan, thus reinforcing the Christian's belief that Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and not just another in a long line of prophets. The Old Testament formed the basis of the ancient hebrew scriptures and, I believe, of considerable relevance to the Jewish faith today. Only Christian fundamentalists, as opposed to all Christians, believe in its literal sense.

Whatever one may think of other views, it is part of the British culture that we are tolerant of other people's beliefs and philosophies as long as they don't impact on our own freedoms of choice, speech and expression. This includes Islam, Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism etc etc. I find it regrettable that there are posters on this forum who appear outraged by even mild criticism of Islam referrring to it, often erroneously as racism, and then in the same breath bitterly attack Christianity. Tolerance of one, tolerance of all! All faiths unfortunately have extremists within them, and some adherents of every faith, have at some time in their history committed atrocities.

[sarasara]

WTH, do you seriously believe that?

Multiculturalism is the way forward. It is great to see the different mixes of cultures in modern cities. Auckland for example has the largest Polynesian population of any city in the world, it also has one of the highest Chinese populations outside of China I heard recently. It is amazing to see all the different cultures mixing so well.

So stop living in the 19th century.

In Australia it may be. It still has a lot of aboriginal land to steal and it is one of the largest countries in the world. In New Zealand it maybe because that country is still underpopulated.

You also have to bear in mind that New Zealand is a country of zero non-indigenous historic significance with a white culture of so little historical and cultural value that any addition of new cultures will not decrease it's worth. It's non-indigenous population are largely descendents of lower-class Britains whose contribution to world art, literature, music or drama is practically zilch. It has also not had its fair share of Muslims yet.

But to apply that multicultural ideology to the tiny United Kingsom which reports show is in danger of becoming an overpopulated third-world slum with permanent high unemployment is ridiculous.

Britain; which influenced the whole world and once ruled two thirds of it is on the verge of an outbreak of civil war to defend it from people whose vision spans less than a few generations.

No doubt the central core of the BNP is composed of racist, bigoted, homophobic scum, but joining forces with them are large numbers of Britains who are gathering to take on the fascist uberliberal, ubermulticultural one party state and to fight to maintain their country's ideals, identity, history and values from those who place the history and values of immigrants and particularly Muslim immigrants on par with theirs.

From the valleys of Wales to the highlands of Scotland to the Heart of England swords are being sharpened and shields forged for this fight. It may not come to blows, but battle will be waged in the ballot box and on the streets!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJN-wrtuWOg

[Midas]

In Australia it may be. It still has a lot of aboriginal land to steal and it is one of the largest countries in the world.

Would you care to elaborate on that remark? Aboriginal land to steal is a very emotive and hugely biased comment. Have you any experience of what the situation is there, have you ever been there and seen it for yourself, or are you simply quoting words from someone else?

[DC]

In Australia it may be. It still has a lot of aboriginal land to steal and it is one of the largest countries in the world. In New Zealand it maybe because that country is still underpopulated.

Doesn't exist, they had no concept of land ownership, nor any actual use of it aside from gathering wild fruits.

[British]

Doesn't exist, they had no concept of land ownership, nor any actual use of it aside from gathering wild fruits.

From my understanding, this is very true. However, the way they view the land makes it no less theirs. That land sustains them and is very spiritual to them. For western civilisation to just go in and move them to one side...
Taboo