Fixed retirement age to be axed

[Yeti]

The government is planning to scrap the default retirement age in the UK from October 2011.
Under the proposal, employers would not be allowed to dismiss staff because they had reached the age of 65.
Activists, who have long campaigned against the rule, welcomed the proposal as a "victory" against ageism.
Currently, an employer can force an employee to retire at the age of 65 without paying any financial compensation.

BBC News - Fixed retirement age to be axed

Sounds like a good idea to me?

[soloman]

The government is planning to scrap the default retirement age in the UK from October 2011.
Under the proposal, employers would not be allowed to dismiss staff because they had reached the age of 65.
Activists, who have long campaigned against the rule, welcomed the proposal as a "victory" against ageism.
Currently, an employer can force an employee to retire at the age of 65 without paying any financial compensation.

BBC News - Fixed retirement age to be axed

Sounds like a good idea to me?

Roll it on!
We may need to ensure there are safeguards for those who are medically unable to continue.
This does not mean that a 65 year old plus, wll necessarily be continuing in exactly the same position, as that would seriously hinder younger newer employers prospects of promotion.

[Yeti]

Roll it on!
We may need to ensure there are safeguards for those who are medically unable to continue.
This does not mean that a 65 year old plus, wll necessarily be continuing in exactly the same position, as that would seriously hinder younger newer employers prospects of promotion.

The key point is really removing the barrier that is stopping those that want or need to continue in work from doing so.

[soloman]

The key point is really removing the barrier that is stopping those that want or need to continue in work from doing so.

Interesting that it will not be implemented until October 2011?

[Tantal]

Employment of any kind should be performance-based. If an old man is still kicking ass and taking names at 70, as my grandfather was, why put him out to pasture? If, OTOH, he can't cut it anymore, retire his ass or compel him to seek employment elsewhere.

[soloman]

Employment of any kind should be performance-based. If an old man is still kicking ass and taking names at 70, as my grandfather was, why put him out to pasture? If, OTOH, he can't cut it anymore, retire his ass or compel him to seek employment elsewhere.

Agreed!

[Yeti]

Employment of any kind should be performance-based. If an old man is still kicking ass and taking names at 70, as my grandfather was, why put him out to pasture? If, OTOH, he can't cut it anymore, retire his ass or compel him to seek employment elsewhere.

Indeed, they need to make it a little easier to sack people because they are crap at there jobs. With all the tribunals and unions getting in volved its a nightmare to sack someone with out having to pay out masses of compensation, its seems to have changed massively in the last ten years for some reason.

[Midas]

Indeed, they need to make it a little easier to sack people because they are crap at there jobs. With all the tribunals and unions getting in volved its a nightmare to sack someone with out having to pay out masses of compensation, its seems to have changed massively in the last ten years for some reason.

I couldn't agree more! During the 16 years that my then business partner and I built up our own business we were very careful who we employed and consequently we had very few occasions to dismiss people, however back then during the time when Maggie was PM ( ) it was a great deal easier to do so than subsequently. During the last few years when I was Chairman of a precision engineering company with up to 350 employees, we had a number of tussles with various official bodies over less than efficient workers. Fortunately we were able to coerce most of those, and a few potential trouble-makers, to accept redundancy as part of a package to make us more efficient, but as you say, it can be a nightmare and can end up being quite expensive to do. At least we never had any union issues, our work force in both businesses having the sense to vote to remain union-free.

What really needs to be done is to revert to the situation whereby employees can be dismissed without any potential legal issues during a 'trial' period of employment, which should be anything up to a year's length in order to get a true assessment of the person's capabilities and attitude to work. As Tantal says, we should also be able to freely keep older people who can have a lifetime of knowledge and experience to pass on to younger workers, but at the same time be able to insist that those older people who were no longer economic to keep, leave under mutually suitable retirement terms.

[Streetwalker]

Pay them a decent pension and the need to work into old age will dissapear. With many unemployed teenagers with no future it is enough already to see the old farts working in our supermarkets and superstores.

By all means up the retirment age but an open ended work to you drop (which is what they are hoping for) isnt in anyones interest

[radical change]

hooooray, although only being 11 and having 60 ish years to that point I still think it is a good move

If somebody wants to work longer and they are fit enough they should be allowed to

[manrow]

hooooray, although only being 11 and having 60 ish years to that point I still think it is a good move

If somebody wants to work longer and they are fit enough they should be allowed to

A very wise posting!

[coalition]

A very wise posting!

HO HUM! A nice clean path back to slavery. Will people never learn?

[Midas]

HO HUM! A nice clean path back to slavery. Will people never learn?

Not sure I understand your implication here.

[radical change]

Not sure I understand your implication here.

me neither

[coalition]

It took many years and Two world wars for the people to obtain the rights to a pension at ages 60 Women and 65 Men, apparently you and those like you think its really smart to accept that this fascistic dismemberment of these hard won and even harder paid for retirement rights, whilst those who robbed us can retire when they choose, humantarian rights should so easily be disposed of. We are regressing to the early industrial period when people could be disposed of by employers as it suited them. And, make no mistake it won't take long for the 'Cameron Yuppies' to work out how they can abuse the older workers who now have no rights. Hero's: its just another tory con trick.

[soloman]

It took many years and Two world wars for the people to obtain the rights to a pension at ages 60 Women and 65 Men, apparently you and those like you think its really smart to accept that this fascistic dismemberment of these hard won and even harder paid for retirement rights, whilst those who robbed us can retire when they choose, humantarian rights should so easily be disposed of. We are regressing to the early industrial period when people could be disposed of by employers as it suited them. And, make no mistake it won't take long for the 'Cameron Yuppies' to work out how they can abuse the older workers who now have no rights. Hero's: its just another tory con trick.

I don't analyse the situation this way round at all. To my simple mind an employer will not in future be able to retire an employee arbitrarily at age 65. That is surely progress not some devious coalition abuse of employee's rights?

[coalition]

I don't analyse the situation this way round at all. To my simple mind an employer will not in future be able to retire an employee arbitrarily at age 65. That is surely progress not some devious coalition abuse of employee's rights?

Nobodys mind is that simple .... unless

[soloman]

Nobodys mind is that simple .... unless

I delight in having a simple mind, I don't need to think up devious reasons why progress has been achieved with a simple solution!

[coalition]

I delight in having a simple mind, I don't need to think up devious reasons why progress has been achieved with a simple solution!

I def. agree with you about not thinking;cannot understand the rest of the drivel.

[Midas]

It took many years and Two world wars for the people to obtain the rights to a pension at ages 60 Women and 65 Men, apparently you and those like you think its really smart to accept that this fascistic dismemberment of these hard won and even harder paid for retirement rights, whilst those who robbed us can retire when they choose, humantarian rights should so easily be disposed of. We are regressing to the early industrial period when people could be disposed of by employers as it suited them. And, make no mistake it won't take long for the 'Cameron Yuppies' to work out how they can abuse the older workers who now have no rights. Hero's: its just another tory con trick.

I disagree with you; all this is trying to do is to ensure that those people who wish to work beyond the age of 65 can do so. No-one is forcing them to do so and no-one is preventing people who wish to retire at that age from doing so. I fail to see any problem at all.

[radical change]

Well atleast this gives people the choice to work for longer if they want to

[coalition]

I disagree with you; all this is trying to do is to ensure that those people who wish to work beyond the age of 65 can do so. No-one is forcing them to do so and no-one is preventing people who wish to retire at that age from doing so. I fail to see any problem at all.

What can one respond to this: Oh, I know, you can fool some of the people all of the time ..... you know how the rest goes, do you not.

[soloman]

I disagree with you; all this is trying to do is to ensure that those people who wish to work beyond the age of 65 can do so. No-one is forcing them to do so and no-one is preventing people who wish to retire at that age from doing so. I fail to see any problem at all.

It seems even this delightfully simple explanation is too difficult for some posters Midas!

[Major Sinic]

A simple and fair piece of legislation from a seeming progressive government, which extends the rights of all workers, and does nothing to compromise or restrict workers rights. Only someone of severely restricted intelligence could misinterpret this policy.

[crazylilting]

It took many years and Two world wars for the people to obtain the rights to a pension at ages 60 Women and 65 Men, apparently you and those like you think its really smart to accept that this fascistic dismemberment of these hard won and even harder paid for retirement rights, whilst those who robbed us can retire when they choose, humantarian rights should so easily be disposed of. We are regressing to the early industrial period when people could be disposed of by employers as it suited them. And, make no mistake it won't take long for the 'Cameron Yuppies' to work out how they can abuse the older workers who now have no rights. Hero's: its just another tory con trick.

A tory trick? I personally know a woman who because she was 65 was forced to quite her job as a cleaner and simply could not afford to quit. Your so called fight for retirement at what ever age you want, while might be nice for you so you can sit on your ass earlier, is driving others into the poor house.

[coalition]

A tory trick? I personally know a woman who because she was 65 was forced to quite her job as a cleaner and simply could not afford to quit. Your so called fight for retirement at what ever age you want, while might be nice for you so you can sit on your ass earlier, is driving others into the poor house.

I too know a woman, who about to retire finds out that there is no money in the pension pot, it appears it was stolen by the City. My wife is a Uni. Lecturer and I'am now her pension fund, I wish you all well working until you drop or, in some cases I get the impression that some were not quite working, more a case of fiddling as Rome Burned.

[crazylilting]

I too know a woman, who about to retire finds out that there is no money in the pension pot, it appears it was stolen by the City. My wife is a Uni. Lecturer and I'am now her pension fund, I wish you all well working until you drop or, in some cases I get the impression that some were not quite working, more a case of fiddling as Rome Burned.

I don't think the idea is to work until you drop. It is about choice to continue and not have a forced age in which you have to retire. I certainly would like to retire early. But i haven't planned as well as i should of so i will probably work at least till i'm 60. I might putter around later then that but at a slower pace i'm sure. Sorry to hear about your wife's pension fund by the way.

[Midas]

I too know a woman, who about to retire finds out that there is no money in the pension pot, it appears it was stolen by the City. My wife is a Uni. Lecturer and I'am now her pension fund, I wish you all well working until you drop or, in some cases I get the impression that some were not quite working, more a case of fiddling as Rome Burned.

"Stolen by the City" - do you mean that she, like many people, forgot that investment funds, which include pensions, can go down in value as well as up in value? It's got nothing to do with anything being stolen, it's simply that they're worth less than they were.

[ryoden]

I too know a woman, who about to retire finds out that there is no money in the pension pot, it appears it was stolen by the City. My wife is a Uni. Lecturer and I'am now her pension fund, I wish you all well working until you drop or, in some cases I get the impression that some were not quite working, more a case of fiddling as Rome Burned.

I personally have no intention of working until I drop, since the age of 24 I was planning to retire early and worked towards that goal and after saving and investment and working in a succession of crappy clerical posts, I have been able to go part time and will soon be mortgage free. Pension pots rarely get abused in the way you mention although it has happened of course and Gordon Browns plundering in that direction when times were good hasn't helped matters but at the end of the day people shouldnt rely on the state for everything. Perhaps if people were encouraged to be independant / self reliant then we wouldnt be in quite such a mess (or rather the individuals wouldnt be suffering quite as badly from the bankers greed and government mismanagement).

Personally I dont like working 9-5 which is why I did what I did but a lot of people enjoy work or they enjoy the social aspect of it, and I think you should have the option of working if you think you are still able to contribute; equally if you are unable to do a job properly your employer should be able to dismiss you.

[Midas]

I personally have no intention of working until I drop, since the age of 24 I was planning to retire early and worked towards that goal and after saving and investment and working in a succession of crappy clerical posts, I have been able to go part time and will soon be mortgage free. Pension pots rarely get abused in the way you mention although it has happened of course and Gordon Browns plundering in that direction when times were good hasn't helped matters but at the end of the day people shouldnt rely on the state for everything. Perhaps if people were encouraged to be independant / self reliant then we wouldnt be in quite such a mess (or rather the individuals wouldnt be suffering quite as badly from the bankers greed and government mismanagement).

Personally I dont like working 9-5 which is why I did what I did but a lot of people enjoy work or they enjoy the social aspect of it, and I think you should have the option of working if you think you are still able to contribute; equally if you are unable to do a job properly your employer should be able to dismiss you.

Having just retired for the second time round, and still in my mid-50s, I can quite understand not wanting to work until you drop. From my own perspective though I tend to get bored after a while and start to look for a new challenge to occupy myself with, however that's a purely personal thing and whatever I do is at least guided by my own hand rather than just as an employee.

Too many people are too reliant on the state for too much though, which includes their pension, and as you say, we should become far more independent and the government should be encouraging those people who want to gain greater financial freedom by offering greater tax concessions on personal savings, investments and personal pensions. With a few limited exceptions such as ISAs it seems to be the other way round though, with tax coming into play which ever way you turn; hardly the best way to encourage self-reliance if all you can see is the government holding out its hand for an ever increasing share!

[Major Sinic]

I personally have no intention of working until I drop, since the age of 24 I was planning to retire early and worked towards that goal and after saving and investment and working in a succession of crappy clerical posts, I have been able to go part time and will soon be mortgage free. Pension pots rarely get abused in the way you mention although it has happened of course and Gordon Browns plundering in that direction when times were good hasn't helped matters but at the end of the day people shouldnt rely on the state for everything. Perhaps if people were encouraged to be independant / self reliant then we wouldnt be in quite such a mess (or rather the individuals wouldnt be suffering quite as badly from the bankers greed and government mismanagement).

Personally I dont like working 9-5 which is why I did what I did but a lot of people enjoy work or they enjoy the social aspect of it, and I think you should have the option of working if you think you are still able to contribute; equally if you are unable to do a job properly your employer should be able to dismiss you.

Good for you! I worked damned hard for most of my working life, established, built and then, in my late forties, sold a fairly successful business ,and then worked part time until my full retirement earlier this year whilst still in my mid fifties (just!). No mortgages, a decent pension fund within my investment portfolio, none of it contributed by the state, and hopefully sufficient time left to enjoy my many interests. Smug and self satisfied? You betcha!! But this legislation gives the individual the freedom to carry on working if inclination and/or necessity require it.

[manrow]

Good for you! I worked damned hard for most of my working life, established, built and then, in my late forties, sold a fairly successful business ,and then worked part time until my full retirement earlier this year whilst still in my mid fifties (just!). No mortgages, a decent pension fund within my investment portfolio, none of it contributed by the state, and hopefully sufficient time left to enjoy my many interests. Smug and self satisfied? You betcha!! But this legislation gives the individual the freedom to carry on working if inclination and/or necessity require it.

It does very much look as though we have now got the message through that this proposal is a benefit whether you wish to retire as now, or later if your situation so demands. A win-win I believe!