This is a discussion on I seem to recall within the United States Politics Forum forums, part of the United States category; Prior to the election everyone stating that the position of vice-president would be that of world statesman while the president ...
busy body
Prior to the election everyone stating that the position of vice-president would be that of world statesman while the president concentrated at home.
Aside from the obvious fear that should the rebublicans have won, foreign policy would have consisted of 'I saw Iraq from a plane', the Democratic government under Obama has somewhat reversed that.
America has always been known as an insular country and laughed at for that. Obama has viewed the entire world as he did the possibility of a blackman of a single parent brought up in Hawaii becoming president of the USA....nothing is impossible.
He has rocked up and got people talking. It amazes me that in a country where Oprah Winfrey can become the most powerful woman...they suddenly doubt this slim, thoughtful chap who can make people want to be reasonable...but then I wonder whether it is more a fear of being part of the world rather than the insularity that occurs with being American?
What is wrong with housing and medicating your people? For such an insular country, is it so bad to look after your own?
Would it be so awful if you didn't send your sons to war because there wasn't one and you were at peace with the East?
Just think of all those extra funds that could be placed into education and employment. Would that be so terrible?
Would it be so terrible to be part of a peaceful world where you do have to recycle and pay a premium for the SUV's? Where helping those less fortunate is the norm?
The man inspires others to be better...what more could you ask?
The Fascist
America has issues ingrained within its psyche, and while powerful, is a very slow social mover. It's probable Europe will outpace America soon, both socially and technologically. Even with a democrat in power, the system and people in it are still VERY right wing.
El Diablo Tejano
Obama distrusts Biden for good reason. He makes an ass of himself and the administration every time he opens his gaping pie-hole.Originally Posted by uncon
If by 'reasonable' you mean 'weak', then, yeah, he's making us 'reasonable'.It amazes me that in a country where Oprah Winfrey can become the most powerful woman...they suddenly doubt this slim, thoughtful chap who can make people want to be reasonable...
Not the government's job. If the lefties want to live a communal lifestyle, let them form a commune. They shouldn't have the right to FORCE me into the commune though.What is wrong with housing and medicating your people? For such an insular country, is it so bad to look after your own?
Maybe if they'll quit bombing ships, blowing up buses, hijacking airplanes, and threatening to "wipe Israel off the map" we could. I'm not a big fan of foreign entanglements either, but the East is at least partially culpable.Would it be so awful if you didn't send your sons to war because there wasn't one and you were at peace with the East?
Education? Maybe. Employment? No. It's not the role of government to guarantee employment. If government will leave the market alone, it will create jobs on its own. For all the leftists bitching about how 'capitalism has failed', it hasn't. It has merely failed to do what the government has tried to coerce, cajole, and force it into doing.Just think of all those extra funds that could be placed into education and employment. Would that be so terrible?
Recycling? No big deal. I already do that anyway. Besides, it's free. Paying a premium for SUVs? We already do. They're more expensive than regular cars, therefore there is a higher tax paid at the time of purchase. Then, at least in Texas, the registration fee (tax) is based on the gross weight of the vehicle, so I pay more. Then there are gasoline (petrol) taxes, of which the government has a much higher margin than even the 'greedy' oil companies. Since my supercharged Land Cruiser gets horrible mileage (11 mpg), I pay through the nose on gasoline taxes, so the government is getting their pound of flesh.Would it be so terrible to be part of a peaceful world where you do have to recycle and pay a premium for the SUV's?
It does need to be the norm, just not through forcible confiscation of the fruits of one's labor by the government. For instance, in about 3 years it's going to be time to get Mrs. Tantal a new vehicle. Her current vehicle will still be worth a considerable sum at that point, but I'm not going to sell it or trade it in. I'm going to give it to our church, who will then give it to a another family or single mother in the church who has fallen on hard times and has no transportation. That's charity from the heart, rather than from the muzzle of the government's gun.....which is robbery. Sure, it's state-sanctioned robbery, but robbery nonetheless.Where helping those less fortunate is the norm?
I could ask that he leave me alone and allow me to be better on my own, rather than him FORCING his own ideas of what 'better' is upon me.The man inspires others to be better...what more could you ask?
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
Ah, but he knows you and many others will never share out of choice- its against your nature. People have to be made to share.
El Diablo Tejano
Perhaps you didn't read my entire post. I love to share. I just like having the choice of exactly WHO I share with.
And now we get down to the nitty-gritty of the subject....government force and bullets. If ever you find yourself beaten and unlawfully relieved of your wallet by a group of misunderstood urban sophisticates, don't think of it as being 'robbed'. Think of it as being 'made to share.'People have to be made to share.
If you people ever wondered why I have so many guns, the mentality of Citizen Smith that he is somehow ENTITLED to my property is the reason.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
busy body
hi sweetie...could be worse - could be Palin. Did you know that someone went through her biography and checked it all (poor bastard must be in a mental home by now) Apparently it was less than 41% truth.
You think that being reasonable is weak? Bad move darling as it tells me that you are not to be intelligently debated with, and I actually thought the comments you made after that were worthy of a debate...no point though if it can't be reasonable is there?If by 'reasonable' you mean 'weak', then, yeah, he's making us 'reasonable'.
Banned
Why have no totalitarians ever answered my Question about why I who work my self into a state of exhaustion each day, i suffer pains throughout my entire body as a result of my work, my work is dangerous, physically exhausting, and will be the cause of my death at some point.
I have to care about those who refuse to work or choose to work in low paid easy to do jobs that require little physical or intellectual input.
I must pay for them to live long and comfortable lives whilst mine is short and painfull.
Why is it that I, who you wish to punish for working, am considered evil and selfish because i do the right thing.Yet the lazy dossers of the world are the good people because they demand that i die a slow and painfull death in order to support their life of lazy comfort and luxuary.
Why are their lives so much more valuable than mine????
What is it about my working and paying my way that devalues me as a Human being?
Why do the totalitarians always refuse to answer this question?
Why should we kill the worker to support the dole dossers??
Come on totalitarians, answer that one!!!!
El Diablo Tejano
Because to leftists, ignorance and sloth are virtues.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
Banned
You will note that none of em have an answer.Guess they hate the workers, just like their Idol Stalin did.
El Diablo Tejano
Actually, they appear to have absolute reverence for the NON-workers. Uncle Joe had his own useful idiots, and, apparently, Labour does too......with many of them posting on this board.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
accidental genius!
OK Pauli, really no idea what question you want answered, but let me ask you one in return, because it really has been bothering me. Why exactly do you work yourself into a state of exhaustion each day, causing your health problems (how are you by the way - latest check up ok?) and sending you to an early grave? I mean, I understand it's good for the soul to work, I really do, but that all seems a bit excessive to me! Should we work to live, or live to work?
"The object of universities is not to make skilful lawyers, physicians or engineers. It is to make capable and cultivated human beings." John Stewart Mill
El Diablo Tejano
My guess is that he needs to provide for himself and his family and is too proud to have the government force others to support him. It's called 'being a man'.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
accidental genius!
Yeah I get that, I do, left wingers have pride too! But to the point where it compromises your quality of life? That's all I'm saying, fair days pay for a fair days wage! Doesn't that sound fair?
"The object of universities is not to make skilful lawyers, physicians or engineers. It is to make capable and cultivated human beings." John Stewart Mill
El Diablo Tejano
What is it with you lefties and 'fairness'? I have no idea how much money Pauli makes for his labor, nor do I care. His labor, health, quality of life, and finances are HIS business, not mine.
I actually find it quite sad that Pauli left the U.K......although I'm more than happy to have him here. Had he stayed home, he could've led your current crop of sniveling, limp-wristed Nancies by example. Unfortunately, European life and the control over the citizenry exercised by the government was more than he could bear.
Pauli is a shining example of Viking manliness and should be applauded for it, rather than scorned.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
accidental genius!
"What is it with the concept of fairness"? And thereby do you define the gap we will never cross in our attempts to better understand the opposing view! Of course all those things are Pauli's own business, I only queried it as he brought it up first and I'm genuinely interested in why he chooses to go that extra mile and keep running the hamster wheel. OK to take an interest is it?
OK that's his choice of course good luck to him.I actually find it quite sad that Pauli left the U.K......although I'm more than happy to have him here. Had he stayed home, he could've led your current crop of sniveling, limp-wristed Nancies by example. Unfortunately, European life and the control over the citizenry exercised by the government was more than he could bear.
I'm sure he is (I've seen the rather fetching pictures) and who the hell is scorning him, I'm not - I really am interested as I think I'd rather be poor and enjoy what little freedom I could afford than put up with all the trouble he has. That's all I'm saying.Pauli is a shining example of Viking manliness and should be applauded for it, rather than scorned.
"The object of universities is not to make skilful lawyers, physicians or engineers. It is to make capable and cultivated human beings." John Stewart Mill
MP
What is it with you righties and selfishness ?
busy body
I have consistently watched Opinionated ask questions on this thread that others have failed to answer.
I have watched people dodge, dance, deflect and run away....now could someone have the nerve to look at the questions raised and answer them in a straight fashion?
El Diablo Tejano
I guess we're both selfish. I want my stuff, and you want my stuff too. We just disagree on who should get MY stuff. I think it should be me because I earned it. You think it should be given to someone else as a reward for their unwillingness to provide for themselves.What is it with you righties and selfishness ?
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
El Diablo Tejano
Actually, I was halfway kidding in that statement. Everyone wants fairness. Where we diverge is how we define 'fairness'. To me, it means equal protection under the law so that someone can make of their life whatever they want. I don't determine 'fairness' based on outcome. I live in a country where a mulatto boy of meager financial means eventually went to Harvard and became President. I also once sent the child of a white millionnaire to prison. Our system was 'fair' to both of these men. One of them just made better choices.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
Banned
The main one would be WHY should the workers, who work their fingers to the bone and suffer all the agony and discomfort of a day on the site for 40 or 60 hours a week in ****ty conditions breaking their backs, be expected to hand over half of that which they worked for in order to support those who refuse to work to take the fruits of the labour of the worker.The worker who suffers to earn his keep the dosser who does nothing but still has a better life, a more comfortable life and a longer easier life that the poor bastard who has to pay for it, how can you justify this situation?
Why do Totalitarians hate the worker so?
I have asked the question a hundred times, it remains unanswered.
I work to live, im working around 60 hrs a week on site and 10 or 20 in the office after work.I earn a decent income but not a great income, i handle larger sounding contracts yet overheads kill my income.
My most recent Drs advice was to quit, same as the last 5 visits, i cant do that because i have responsibilities, its called being an adult and paying your way.Of course that would make me a greedy capitalist nazi racist blah Blah blah, accordint to Totalitarian doctrine.
accidental genius!
Bloody hell Tantal that's almost an endorsement . Actually, I have to agree, it seems very unlikely that someone with a similar background to Obama's would make it to Oxbridge and then lead the country (certainly never going to become Queen)..To a point I also agree with your definition of "fairness", I just have no problem with those who can giving a helping hand to those who can't.
OK, firstly I don't accept the totalitarian label. Beyond that and answering personally I don't think anyone should! You get the concept "from each according to his means; to each according to his needs"? To me that implies that everybody should do what they are capable of doing, you shouldn't be forced to break your back in order to survive but equally you should do what is reasonable to support yourself and contribute to help those with no back. "Dossers", those who cheat the system are criminals and should be treated as such, a seperate issue.
Because Totalitarians hate anybody who may represent a threat to their position of power is the truthful answer, but I do not accept that the label "totalitarian" applies to anyone just because they don't agree with your (and the majority of America) scewed work ethic!Why do Totalitarians hate the worker so?
I've tried now Pauli hope that's sufficient.I have asked the question a hundred times, it remains unanswered.
OK Pauli nice deep breathes for me...my point is, you shouldn't have to that's all! Obviously you want to otherwise you'd move back here and put up with the bits you don't like of the country in order to work less. But you enjoy the way of life nearly killing yourself brings out there, so good luck to you - enjoy it while you can.I work to live, im working around 60 hrs a week on site and 10 or 20 in the office after work.I earn a decent income but not a great income, i handle larger sounding contracts yet overheads kill my income.
My most recent Drs advice was to quit, same as the last 5 visits, i cant do that because i have responsibilities, its called being an adult and paying your way.Of course that would make me a greedy capitalist nazi racist blah Blah blah, according to Totalitarian doctrine.
"The object of universities is not to make skilful lawyers, physicians or engineers. It is to make capable and cultivated human beings." John Stewart Mill
Banned
Dosnt really answer my question though.
As for moving back to the UK, yeah i could but what would i do?I went to find a Job after leaving the Army, the jobcentre refused to allow me to apply for jobs because of the disability that forced me to leave the army.No government agency would hire me, i was even refused shifts on the Bank for the NHS unit i had worked on Bank for 5 years at.
Now do you think for a second that the average Joe worker in the UK does not suffer pain and exhaustion as a result of his work?Or does the average self employed person in the UK not work 60, 80 or more hours a week?
Yes they do, but they suffer for it and the lazy luxuriate in it.You support this rob one to pamper another system?
accidental genius!
I tried my best!
Yeah there are problems with the system I agree, as I understand it, it is a bit better now with help for those less able bodied to do what they can in the workplace.As for moving back to the UK, yeah i could but what would i do?I went to find a Job after leaving the Army, the jobcentre refused to allow me to apply for jobs because of the disability that forced me to leave the army.No government agency would hire me, i was even refused shifts on the Bank for the NHS unit i had worked on Bank for 5 years at.
Oh no I am well aware of how hard the average Joe work.Now do you think for a second that the average Joe worker in the UK does not suffer pain and exhaustion as a result of his work?Or does the average self employed person in the UK not work 60, 80 or more hours a week?
I support, as I have just explained, "from each according to his means, to each according to his needs"; but use your emotive language if you must!Yes they do, but they suffer for it and the lazy luxuriate in it.You support this rob one to pamper another system?
"The object of universities is not to make skilful lawyers, physicians or engineers. It is to make capable and cultivated human beings." John Stewart Mill
Banned
Emotive language?
Yeah there are problems with the system I agree, as I understand it, it is a bit better now with help for those less able bodied to do what they can in the workplace.
Oh no I am well aware of how hard the average Joe work.
I support, as I have just explained, "from each according to his means, to each according to his needs"; but use your emotive language if you must!
From each according to and to each according etc, if ones means are worked for and anothers needs are not worked for how is that in any way equality?
Socialism, communism and all the totalitarian theories in politics all have one goal, to punish the motivated.Look at what Stalin and Lenin did to the Kulaks, this is what Nulab and their totalitarian allies wish to do to the workers.It is a form of hate.
MP
I would love to see the source on that one.
"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people."
-V, Revolution
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the United States of America
El Diablo Tejano
I always thought that you were above quoting directly from the Communist Manifesto, but I guess not.
Your entire economic philosophy is one of outright THEFT. When you break this down to the practical application, what you are essentially saying is that man (or woman) does not own himself. His body and the labor that flows from it inherently belong to someone else, typically those who perform no labor. What a twisted system of values whereby the productive become slaves by virtue of their industriousness and the non-productive become masters by virtue of their ignorance and sloth.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
El Diablo Tejano
Probably the DailyKook, The Huffington Post, or some asshat from Skinner's insane asylum, the Democratic Underground.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
Banned
How are hard working taxed to poverty normal folks in any way selfish?What is it with you righties and selfishness ?
I would say that the do nothing dole dossing scumbags of the earth who expect me and my fellow workers to pay for them to live in luxuary whilst we strive in the most arduous conditions to scrape together a pittance, it is they who are selfish.
I cant understand why those who claim to represent the worker seem to actually be activly engaged in the complete annihilation of the workers.Kind of like the Idol of all socialists, communists and other NAZIs did to the KULAKs (your own Uncle JOE Stalin that is)!!!It is a form of Hate.
Banned
More than likely the government owned and controlled BBC!!!
Thats not socialism. Socialism is taxing the people who can easily afford to lose a lot of money, and helping poor people, like you apparently.
Is it because I was just looking on HMRC website - HM Revenue & Customs: Rates and Allowances - Income Tax and it appears that the government (Democractic Socialist) taxes those earning between Ģ0 - Ģ37,400 at a flat rate of 20 percent above that point it is 40 percent and if you are fortunate enough to earn a salary north of Ģ150,000 you will be left with just 50 percent of your earnings.Thats not socialism. Socialism is taxing the people who can easily afford to lose a lot of money, and helping poor people, like you apparently.
Do explain in your equality driven world why you feel it is okay to take upto 50 percent of a persons annual income irrespective of what that income is but only 20 percent of anothers? Remember I am not discussing wealth or income levels - I am asking specifically about the equality of multiple levels of taxation dependent on income.
MP
It is irrelevant what you think the source is. The fact that anyone thinks they can state seemingly outrageously false statistics without any source is phenomenal.
Moreover, it has been proven that many news organizations simply do not fact check their statements or stories. A prime example of this is the whole Rush Limbaugh buying the Rams issue. Regardless of one's political stance or personal feelings about this individual, it must be agreed upon that it is wrong for major news networks to slander him into oblivion until the NFL forced him out of the purchasing group. In the end they had no source for their supposed quotes.
"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people."
-V, Revolution
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the United States of America
MP
Thats not socialism. Socialism is taxing the people who can easily afford to lose a lot of money, and helping poor people, like you apparently.Winston Churchill. . . a socialist policy is abhorrent to the British ideas of freedom. Socialism is inseparably interwoven with totalitarianism and the abject worship of the state. It will prescribe for every one where they are to work, what they are to work at, where they may go and what they may say. Socialism is an attack on the right to breathe freely. No socialist system can be established without a political police. They would have to fall back on some form of Gestapo, no doubt very humanely directed in the first instance.
(Taken from Alan O. Ebenstein. Friedrich Hayek: A Biography. (2003). University of Chicago Press)
"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people."
-V, Revolution
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the United States of America
Banned
Thats not socialism. Socialism is taxing the people who can easily afford to lose a lot of money, and helping poor people, like you apparently.
You see that is exactly the problem with socialism, i can afford to give up half my income but if i have to why shouldnt i just sit around and take it easy, get my arse on the dole and sponge of the fools who work.Socialism punishes the worker and rewards the lazy dole dossing scumbag.The Taxation of the worker by socialist, totalitarian regimes like the Nazis and NULAB is a hate crime.
I help myself, my family and those in my closest circles, why should i be forced to give up my hard earned income so that a person i do not know, who i would refuse to associate with because of their greedy selfish attitude can have a few babies and get welfare?
I mean spitting out bairns like a GPMG spitting out lead and expecting me to pay for it?That is in your opinion acceptable?I am expected to pay for another mans kids, for some fat slag to get laid and for their illigitimate offspring to grow up and take from my motivated and hard working offspring?
It is the poor sluttish dole dossing sponging scum on the welfare rolls that are selfish, not the workers who earn their income.
MP
The first part of your post is more or less true. It requires a society, because without anyone else what good is money anyway (although I could define money and then make it). I do not need the government in order to make money; however, I would say that, in general, a very limited amount of government oversight (monopoly protection, fraud protection, contract enforcement, etc.) is needed. The government also should protect the citizens i.e. army, navy, police, etc. This is what taxes should go to. The cost of running government. They should not go to redistribution programs, subsidy programs, art programs, etc.
The second part of your post is like saying: I have five gold coins. The government takes two of them to give to two people who have no gold coins. They then give me a gold coin each in order to buy food. Now I have five gold coins. Does that help me?
"People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people."
-V, Revolution
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the United States of America
Banned
I didnt make my money in the market. I made it by finding a job that no one else would do and ****ing going at it with MFV(maximum ****ing violence)in order to get the job done.No Infrastructure no government just me a shovel and a digging fork, then hammers and nails, a dumptruck a few electric chainsaws(gas operated ones would be lethal underground).Yes the roads were built by workers paid by govnt with money from the workers, it is a cycle, what did the lazy scum pay into the market that i earn from (even though i do not).If they do pay in it is with my money so i am in fact paying in twice, once for my needs and once again for their luxuary, i will still be paying long after i am dead for they will live long luxuriant lives while i suffer and die, that is what socialists favor, the long suffering death of the worker, it is a form of Hate.
Banned
Inequality is a result of some having less than others, they have less because they choose idle wastfull lives over motivation and positivity.
But the socialist elitist(often born wealth, no actually looking at most socialists they are all born wealthy) wish to tax the motivated to subsidise the lazy, it is a form of hate!!
Senior MP
You either made our money in a market or gained it from theft or coercion.. Even if you are self employed you will presumably have had to sell your labour to a customer. The government tries to ensure these market conditions are kept stable.
I'm sure you didn't just dig a lot of holes with your impressive array of machinery and then find a magical treasure chest down there?
So unproductive has conservatism been in producing a general conception of how a social order is maintained that its modern votaries, in trying to construct a theoretical foundation, invariably find themselves appealing almost exclusively to authors who regarded themselves as liberal. - F.A. Hayek
Economic Left/Right: 4.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.74
El Diablo Tejano
By this logic, Pauli should send the government EVERYTHING! He'd really be rich then!
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
Banned
Government dosnt pay me, sorry my commie totalitarian exterminator buddy you are wrong.I am paid by my clients none of whom are dole dossers or government, they are private homeowners who choose to invest in preventing their homes from collapsing, the government has nothing to do with it, me, some engineers and a ready mix concrete company that is it.
Your analogy is of a bigger guy taking my company for himself?Isnt that exactly what you totalitarians want?The government owns everything, the motivated are worked to death the lazy are paid well and kept in copfort and the intellectuals run the whole thing exterminating those who speak out against them, it is a form of hate!!!
Banned
Really it is your argument that confiscating the workers income and giving it to a bunch of fat lazy ignorant greedy dimwits is a good economic decision.Where in your totalitarian utopia would you encourage the motivated to earn enough to support the lazy, they would see the lazy living in luxuary and stop working and demand the same luxuary themselves.Would you utilise the Gas chamber to encourage the worker to hand over his earnings and live in poverty so that your lazy bums will have all the luxuary you bribed em with???
Didn't George Orwell write something with a plotline similar to that?
Banned
So in your opinion it is OK for me to work myself into an early grave(and for other workers to do the same) so that lazy fat bastards with illigitamate bastard kids can live in luxuary?
Only the lazy living in luxuary have the right to an income. even if they didnt earn that same money, a worker earns his income by the sweat of his brow, if money or government didnt exist the worker would still survive, the intellectual and the lazy bag of **** would die out.The government and the global infrastructure is therefore the property of those who built it, the worker, not the intellectual theorist or the ****ing lazy bag of **** dole dosser.
We should allow the worker to keep his income, cap taxation at 5% and let the lazy bums sink or swim.
Banned
You wish!!!
the worker ownes the government, that is democracy.
The government ****s over the workers robs them of their meagre income allows them to suffer in pain and poverty whilst dishing out the hard earned money of the worker to the lazy irrisponsible dole dosses and welfare slags etc, that is socialism,comunism, nazism, fascism or totalitarianism in any of its forms.
It is a form of hate!!
I very firmly believe that if things were fair, almost everyone who could b given a job would want to work.
I know this is a debatable point but thats my opinion, that
IF SOCIETY ACTUALLY TREATED PEOPLE FAIRLY THEY WOULD WANT TO CONTRIBUTE, INSTEAD OF FEELING RESENTFUL.
Chancellor
For once I'm inclined to agree with you! However I would add a number of caveats to that insofar as the government should:-
Only then would society be much fairer in that everyone would have the freedom of choice to take up what services they so wished rather than be bound to paying over the odds for inefficient and expensive government ones, and they'd have far more money in their pay-packets with which to be able to so do. Coincidentally it would also give many people back their sense of self-dependency, personal responsibility and their right to determine their own future.
- confine its activities solely to governing the country on the wider basis, not try to micromanage it
- severely control its own expenditure in order to give far better value for money on those services it does retain control of
- allow private enterprise to take over many areas where government presently does such an inefficient job, and
- only charge people the absolute minimum of tax necessary to perform its much reduced services.
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised 'for the good of its victims' may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us 'for our own good' will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C.S. Lewis
Banned
What a commie says and what a commie does are two different things.No commie system has done anything for a worker exept enslave them and murder them, any who desire to see communism forced onto a society are trying to murder the workers.Very few commies are workers, most are overeducated arrogant middleclass haters of the worker.They become commies so that they can controll the lives of others, they are power mad psychopaths.
Their policies against the workers are indeed a form of Hate.
Banned
In real terms CS no one wants to work, we work because we need money in order to survive.Some do nothing but still get MY money in order to live long luxuriant lives of comfort and ease, yet i who earned the money do not have that option.I am being ripped off here, by the government and the lazy dole dossing scumbags of the world and the fat slags on food stamps who choose to spit out bastards like a GPMG spitting lead.They the evil selfish sluts expect me to pay for their little bastards upkeep.I say NO to this hate based system designed to exterminate the motivated.It is a form of hate.
busy body
I think often the job thing can very much depend on area. As you know I am conducting my own experiment into this which ends on Sunday by working in the local shop. It is physical work involving a lot of lifting and yet it is those that are older (mainly women) doing it while the young men waltz around looking to avoid any kind of work at all and complain they are bored. Let me make it clear that we are looking at chaps under 25...those over that age are quite gentlemanly in their assistance.
I have watched people of both sexes under the age of twenty avoid actually doing the job. I have also watched a couple in that age group work very hard...but it is hardly surprising that the owner is more inclined to recruit his staff from women in their twenties and thirties.
Perhaps we are not bringing our children up to think that any job is better than none? Our little Princes and princesses expect to be just that, when we should be saying - you do what it takes to earn.
El Diablo Tejano
Holy Bat****! I think I've finally found something that we agree upon. Fresh out of college, I didn't have a job in my chosen career field yet, but I COULD NOT go back to live with my parents. So, I found something to get me by until I found the job I wanted. I took a job at Target (retail chain here in the U.S.....sort of a higher class Wal-Mart) making $8.00/hr. I had roommates and was barely getting by, but at least I was independent and not relying on someone else for my sustenance. Point is, you take what you can get and keep an eye out for better opportunities. What you DON'T do is demand a check for sitting on your ass.
"That's a man.....That's a stand tall, walk straight, put God's share in the collection plate, Man"- Jack Ingram
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